Stake originals rigging?

[STL2L]

That’s exactly how I feel with Mines. Do well at small bets, raise it big, and first square is a mine. Even when playing with a single mine. Happens 75 percent of the time

[Filxixo]

True...there are some games that dont match 

[GreyArea]

So the RTP has something to do with the outcome of your bet? I thought it was determined by RNG? If that’s the case how can that be said as fair if it’s determined by RTP. In that case of course we would lose everything every time. And only win probably if we was already down a bunch. I’m not whining, I’m just saying if it’s not truely random like it should be then that’s not fair. That’s why most people lose probably when betting big. If someone calls that fair, I don’t know what’s wrong with them…

[dupeddonk]

46 minutes ago, GreyArea said:

So the RTP has something to do with the outcome of your bet? I thought it was determined by RNG? If that’s the case how can that be said as fair if it’s determined by RTP. In that case of course we would lose everything every time. And only win probably if we was already down a bunch. I’m not whining, I’m just saying if it’s not truely random like it should be then that’s not fair. That’s why most people lose probably when betting big. If someone calls that fair, I don’t know what’s wrong with them…

The outcome is determined by hashing the players seed, server seed and nonce (the provably fair system).

The rtp is determined by the payout structures of each game.

For example: you make a dice bet that the result will be under 50.  The provably fair system determines the number, which then determines the outcome.  That's all it does is take your seed, the server seed and the nonce and spit out a number that is completely unpredictable by either party. 

The potential payout if you win (1.98x your bet in this case) determines the rtp.

With a 1.98x payout, the rtp is 99%. If they changed it to 2x, the rtp would be 100%.  1.96% would be 98%.  

Remember, rtp is theoretical return a player could expect if they were to make the bet an infinite number of times.  The variance is what makes it gambling and gives players a chance to walk away ahead.

 

 

 

[GreyArea]

33 minutes ago, dupeddonk said:

The outcome is determined by hashing the players seed, server seed and nonce (the provably fair system).

The rtp is determined by the payout structures of each game.

For example: you make a dice bet that the result will be under 50.  The provably fair system determines the number, which then determines the outcome.  That's all it does is take your seed, the server seed and the nonce and spit out a number that is completely unpredictable by either party. 

The potential payout if you win (1.98x your bet in this case) determines the rtp.

With a 1.98x payout, the rtp is 99%. If they changed it to 2x, the rtp would be 100%.  1.96% would be 98%.  

Remember, rtp is theoretical return a player could expect if they were to make the bet an infinite number of times.  The variance is what makes it gambling and gives players a chance to walk away ahead.

 

 

 

Ok but why do I see it way to often in dice, limbo and mines where the same number/mine outcome happens 2 or 3 times in a row. This happens more than what seems possible. With dice there 10000 possible outcomes, and more often than what seems normal, for as many outcomes there are it lands within the first 2 and on the right side 98 and above. And a lot of times it will switch from less than 2 to 98 and above on the next roll, which makes it even impossible to win playing over and under in the advanced settings because it lands on less than 2 and over 98 percent quite a bit. More than what seems even possible. And it’s not just like every now and then if you let it run it happens a lot. And with 10000 possible outcomes that doesn’t seem like it would happen over and over and over and over within a short amount of time…

on limbo if the number is suppose to be o be random, why does it land on less than 2x most of the time and less and less and less the higher the X payout. For example, a payout less than 2x happens hundreds of times within a thousand rolls. But if your playing to hit 200x it does not happen for a huge amount of rolls… now thinking about what I just said, if this outcome on limbo is random  why does it go less than 2x more a than anything? And even less 3x-4x-5x and so on. The higher the less chance. I just don’t understand how that is “random” because if it was I can guarantee you those wouldn’t be the true outcomes. 
 

on mines, same thing over and over again,  within a short amount of rolls, the bomb is on the same block. I’ve seen it on 4 blocks within back to back within not even a thousands rolls and 2 blocks happens a crazy amount of times in a short amount of rolls. 
 

if you are wondering or don’t understand  why people are concerned about how this happens so much, where are you from? Not earth.. can’t be. Because that’s like hitting the lottery alll the time. That’s why people can’t believe the system. I don’t blame them for feeling bad or getting mad because it just seems impossible. Again I will repeat, I’m not whining. This is serious stuff that should even be addressed by Stake so players better understand and won’t complain all the time. maybe if your reading this instead of bashing me and others for being concerned of these outcomes you can help us believe and prove why we should believe in the system. Makes “Everyone” believe it’s not possible to be rigged. Because that certainly isn’t the case now, I guarantee many people can’t believe. I know there are many believers and that’s fine and I’m not saying I ain’t a believer, I just wonder.. nothing wrong with wondering. And honestly there’s also nothing wrong with not believing because everyone has a right to feel how they think they should feel. 

That’s my 2 cents. I know it’s been said more times than 1 time before, honestly probably thousands of times on this forum. Which leads me to preach to you even more if this many people are concerned, there’s a problem somewhere. And all of the problem isn’t the people, there’s lack of understanding in alot of cases and there are alot of people that “wonder” because they “don’t know for sure”. 
 

there’s more I would like to say but I’ll probably just be called stupid for saying how I feel, so why should I bother?

 

 

[GreyArea]

24 minutes ago, dupeddonk said:

You're seeing patterns that aren't really there and then getting yourself stuck in basically a never ending confirmation bias loop.

There have been lots of studies done on it.  It's human nature and the very reason gambling is addictive.

You're brain isn't a computer.  It's not capable of building and maintaining a database the way you think it is.  You have to have faith in math, not the way things feel to you, to realize the truth.

Check out the abstract from this study:

Betting on Illusory Patterns: Probability Matching in Habitual Gamblers

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10899-015-9539-9

Or here's a short summary of it: 

https://time.com/3841369/gamblers-gambling-addiction-gaming-patterns/

 

 

 

Ok thanks for that, but can you explain limbo and why we see a lot more 1x-1.99x than 2x and so on ? The higher the X the less it happens.. this can’t be a pattern in my brain if you can clearly see that 1X-1.99X happen waaay more frequently than anything above it. The higher the less chance it will happen. That’s not random though. 

[Tarrterr]

Btw fun fact, you know how in blackjack you get dealt a card, then dealer, then you and then dealer again? 

 

Well according to provably fair, every stake original bet has actually been incorrectly calculated.  With provably fair, they count the first 2 cards dealt as yours, and next 2 dealt as the dealers. 

That's not how BJ works or has ever worked, even the animation is correct, but order of calculating cards is not.

For example just made a random BJ bet, see how first card is 3, 2nd K, 3rd 7 and 4th 9?

 

It should be 3,7 for player, and K,9 for dealer, yet that isn't the case. 

When contacting support about it, they say it doesn't matter which card is calculated first.

That makes me question, if they can choose what card to use, from an infinite row of cards, can't they do that with every game by just choosing the most favorable outcome?

[GreyArea]

31 minutes ago, dupeddonk said:

Once that's generated it can be used to generate an outcome by applying a specific formula depending on which game is being played.

Could this formula have something to do with why patterns happen quite frequently?

[dupeddonk]

Just now, GreyArea said:

Could this formula have something to do with why patterns happen quite frequently?

 

[kiel1407]

well it's like your playing against a computer with giving them great odds. yeah pretty much rigged KAPPA.

[Dave1280]

On 6/30/2021 at 6:17 PM, dupeddonk said:

The outcome is determined by hashing the players seed, server seed and nonce (the provably fair system).

Hey, just read a related thread regarding some of your posts in this topic.. Just wanted to say, that I'm always glad to see your contribution to any thread.. Always constructive, informative, and rational. 

Hopefully, you got things sorted.. As your input in this thread is non emotive and factual.. We all know (or should know) gamblers will try and blame everything for their loss, rigged systems, scams, a curse placed upon them by someone.. When in fact it's gambling.. You know the house always wins, you just have to hope you catch a streak of results going in your favour and make the most of them! 

[Dexthesexx]

@Ghostnipplehey man that’s exactly what happened to me even at extremely high win chnace I’ll get an extremely long streak and just when I’m about to bust I’ll win but and get back to where I was before the streak and before I know it I bust shortly after.

would love to speak to you again

[KarmaCrew]

I 100% know that autobot w/ dice is rigged. There's no way you lose 80+ in a row w/ 50/50 odds

[FapMaster]

All stake original games are rigged. For me Crash will skip a round or two before placing my bet. It won't allow me to cancel or leave. Missing nonce with Dice and Scarab and Samurai resets after hitting a bonus.

 

It happened again and this time live support asked me to email tech support. They saw what was happening and was able to return one of my bets. They said that they would look into the issue if I can sent them other bet IDs. The thing is it will eat my wager and not post a bet id. When I checked my achieved bets, the same bet IDs are shower up 2 to 4 times. Hopefully I might be able to get back some of my $120 in wagers that it stole. Live support is garbage unless you're Plat and above. Even tech support said that they've had no issues and that I'm the only one that this has happened to. I talked to multiple stake users who've complained about the same thing. Either live support is incompetent or tech support is lying. Probably both. 

[Optimost]

 I did is to refresh many times 

[GreyArea]

On 7/17/2021 at 11:16 PM, Ghostnipple said:

Yes there are pattern's in the games. Some are short lived others stick around for longer.
None of stake's games are random.

There are two perspectives on almost everything in a casino.
    The players' and the casino's.

    The casino deals in big numbers millions of bets, where variance is neutralised by 
    averaging over the long run and the house edge guarantees a profit of 1% of wager volume.

    The players' experience is in the small numbers where the variance can be devastating. A player could
    spend months betting at 10x and never see his win rate match the stated win chance.

    Casinos Talk about house edge, Win Chance, RTP because that is what is of interest to the Casino.
    But for the player they arent that useful

   Casino's don't discuss the win rate in a game or the level of variance in a seed.
   That's what is useful to the player.

Thanks for the reply 😁

[7thRebuke]

Among all, I can say Stake Blackjack is haha . I don't know if I'm the only one feeling it lol. 

 

Most of the time I get;

 

• 20 and Dealer auto BJ 21

• Dealer most of the time gets Face Card (J,Q,K or 10 as start card)

• I hit and manage to get to 18 to 20. And still Dealer manages to get 21 with many hits haha

• I get 12 as Start Cards , If I hit , most of the time gets 10,J,Q,K to 22 Bust 

 

*Just my experience

 

[Tobiasthybo]

Never trust the rocket

 

[fischback123]

Its 100% rigged 

i was playing dice with autobet with a martingale strategy i set bet to 0,008doge

after a very long row of loses(its possible) i won but the autobot kept playing with my latest highest bet and i lost everything.

 

here is a screenshot

and here the chat with live support

i never used a vpn in my whole life.

 

[Dexthesexx]

I’m not surprised man. Stake always blame it on the players. I don’t understand how a simple betting system can be vpn’s fault

[GreyArea]

What does having a vpn active while playing on stake do?

[FancyPants]

Ok, so there's real people that actually see exactly what i see - Especially LIMBO, that shit... The actual fuck is that... 

 

So to cut the crap because this provably fair has been ruining me and many others for many of years... Betsize and seemingly bet delay/timing fully affects the outcome to somewhat of an extent.

They claim:

serverseed,clientseed,nonce calculation allows no manipulation. This is true. Except player is only aware of the hashed server seed which i have little knowledge about but apparently NO PARTS of a seed's character can change whatsoever without the matching hash not matching? IF this is definitely the case; It's somehow done at the last of the process maybe?

I don't understand why after its hashed together serverSeed,clientSeed,nonce the system cant simply choose the first numbers without all the need for the last bit.. Cant it be as simple as below? 

[ltcDaddy]

16 minutes ago, FancyPants said:

Ok, so there's real people that actually see exactly what i see - Especially LIMBO, that shit... The actual fuck is that... 

 

So to cut the crap because this provably fair has been ruining me and many others for many of years... Betsize and seemingly bet delay/timing fully affects the outcome to somewhat of an extent.

They claim:

serverseed,clientseed,nonce calculation allows no manipulation. This is true. Except player is only aware of the hashed server seed which i have little knowledge about but apparently NO PARTS of a seed's character can change whatsoever without the matching hash not matching? IF this is definitely the case; It's somehow done at the last of the process maybe?

I don't understand why after its hashed together serverSeed,clientSeed,nonce the system cant simply choose the first numbers without all the need for the last bit.. Cant it be as simple as below? 

You should be able to check your bet archive or verify the results to disprove this if you think a bet was fishy. I say “should” because there are bets missing from the archive. Everyones archive, I would bet. 
It should have the full seed so you can see if the rest of it was altered. Or they could just do what you are suggesting and change it back in the 24 hours it takes them to put the bets in the archive. Since it’s not immediately available unless you copy down and manually check each one, there is room for manipulation there.
I wonder why the archives are delayed by a full 24 hours. I’m sure there is a logical database-related answer, but I’m curious. 
 

Food for thought. 

[Asmerah]

same happened to me and stat sometimes not working....

[Manueln06]

originals is hard to make money off .. crash is often lagging