ulululu Posted June 24, 2022 #1 Posted June 24, 2022 Why is there even a limit? Does that not undermine the provably fair aspect? I should be able to decide my client seed whenever i feel like it should i not?
daniel112 Posted June 24, 2022 #2 Posted June 24, 2022 probably to prevent bots from creating millions of seeds in minutes and overwhelming the site
Primequin Posted June 24, 2022 #3 Posted June 24, 2022 You got my attention with your profile. Nicely done.
ulululu Posted June 24, 2022 Author #4 Posted June 24, 2022 2 minutes ago, Primequin said: You got my attention with your profile. Nicely done.
Morim15 Posted June 24, 2022 #5 Posted June 24, 2022 7 hours ago, ulululu said: Por que existe mesmo um limite? Isso não prejudica o aspecto comprovadamente justo? Devo ser capaz de decidir a semente do meu cliente sempre que sentir que não devo? Também não concordo com eles impor limites na mudança da semente , assim comprova mais ainda que a justiça é falha e enganosa.
ulululu Posted June 24, 2022 Author #6 Posted June 24, 2022 24 minutes ago, Morim15 said: Também não concordo com eles impor limites na mudança da semente , assim comprova mais ainda que a justiça é falha e enganosa. Absolutely agree.
dupeddonk Posted June 25, 2022 #7 Posted June 25, 2022 I think you can thank hufflepuff for the limit. https://medium.com/@Stunna/breaking-the-house-63f1021a3e6d
iamback1992 Posted June 25, 2022 #8 Posted June 25, 2022 I hate that too but the site would a sitting duck for DDOS attack if they don't limit it and then we are gonna complain why stake is slow lol
ulululu Posted June 25, 2022 Author #9 Posted June 25, 2022 7 hours ago, dupeddonk said: I think you can thank hufflepuff for the limit. https://medium.com/@Stunna/breaking-the-house-63f1021a3e6d Well how does the limit change this? There should be used and unused seeds. And even though there are only so many possible server seeds...they are manyyyyyyyyyyyyy
dupeddonk Posted June 25, 2022 #11 Posted June 25, 2022 1 hour ago, ulululu said: Well how does the limit change this? There should be used and unused seeds. And even though there are only so many possible server seeds...they are manyyyyyyyyyyyyy The exploit involved requesting thousands of server seeds.
ulululu Posted June 25, 2022 Author #13 Posted June 25, 2022 1 hour ago, dupeddonk said: The exploit involved requesting thousands of server seeds. In a fraction of a second, just limit to 1 seed per 5 seconds, ez.
nniks19 Posted June 30, 2022 #15 Posted June 30, 2022 On 6/24/2022 at 10:27 AM, daniel112 said: probably to prevent bots from creating millions of seeds in minutes and overwhelming the site People with level 2 verification should have this limit increased then.
nuuuitsjdragon Posted June 30, 2022 #16 Posted June 30, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 10:43 AM, dupeddonk said: I think you can thank hufflepuff for the limit. https://medium.com/@Stunna/breaking-the-house-63f1021a3e6d What a great read, thanks for sharing that! I have heard bits and pieces of the story involving the infamous "HufflePuff" but to have the entire story narrated by Stunna (who was personally involved) was extremely riveting. For the devs, was the desire to not let history repeat itself, a major contribution to the source of all these server-sided issues on Stake in recent times?
kayttobr Posted June 30, 2022 #17 Posted June 30, 2022 On 6/24/2022 at 10:43 PM, dupeddonk said: I think you can thank hufflepuff for the limit. https://medium.com/@Stunna/breaking-the-house-63f1021a3e6d This raises a red flag on the provably fair system don't you think? That you have the option to skip nonces and what not and the only way to see that is to verify the seed and go through the bets one by one on your "sussy loss". https://cointelegraph.com/news/dicebitcoin-accused-of-cheating-players It's nothing new now is it? Isn't it what is happening here as well in many scenarios but I think people are too gullible to check through their bets.
dupeddonk Posted July 1, 2022 #18 Posted July 1, 2022 Yeah, 30 minutes ago, kayttobr said: This raises a red flag on the provably fair system don't you think? That you have the option to skip nonces and what not and the only way to see that is to verify the seed and go through the bets one by one on your "sussy loss". https://cointelegraph.com/news/dicebitcoin-accused-of-cheating-players It's nothing new now is it? Isn't it what is happening here as well in many scenarios but I think people are too gullible to check through their bets. The house could skip nonces, or they could anticipate players future client seeds, or they could just screw over any player that just uses the pre-filled client seed, or they could force a player to offline when player is approaching a big win. I've gone over all these possibilities and more multiple times. To "know" that the outcome of each bet was not manipulated requires the player to have a basic understanding of encryption/one way hash functions and how the provably fair system works, as well as some effort to avoid doing something that could be exploited. None of this changes the fact that the norm on this forum is for ignorant rigtards to make irrational arguments and then refuse to have any sort of good faith discussion afterwards. Usually they attempt to defend their point, and when it falls apart point to one of the possibilities I listed in first paragraph (which has nothing to do with their original claim), and then just start attacking me.
kayttobr Posted July 1, 2022 #19 Posted July 1, 2022 2 minutes ago, dupeddonk said: Yeah, The house could skip nonces, or they could anticipate players future client seeds, or they could just screw over any player that just uses the pre-filled client seed, or they could force a player to offline when player is approaching a big win. I've gone over all these possibilities and more multiple times. To "know" that the outcome of each bet was not manipulated requires the player to have a basic understanding of encryption/one way hash functions and how the provably fair system works, as well as some effort to avoid doing something that could be exploited. None of this changes the fact that the norm on this forum is for ignorant rigtards to make irrational arguments and then refuse to have any sort of good faith discussion afterwards. Usually they attempt to defend their point, and when it falls apart point to one of the possibilities I listed in first paragraph, and then just start attacking me. I think the main issue is that at Stake we operate at pre-determined values that are known by the casino which only gives room for manipulation and what not, not saying they're doing it, but there's always a possibility to do so. As you've mentioned above with the possibilities, and options they can do so, we are kind of operating in a gray area and well we accept it cause we're playing, Stake is a great place, I just wish there's more integrity built in and make it feel more safe. Because as of now, I am not going to lie, it doesn't feel as safe as it used to be, and these things seems to happen more and more often, I really enjoy being here at Stake but it seems harder and harder to stay day by day, it's sad if it comes to the day where I have to change a casino because of the lack of integrity in the website, there's a lot of great staff members here and I wish we would be more transparent, both parties both users and staff.
akosirows Posted July 1, 2022 #20 Posted July 1, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 7:41 PM, Shawn19 said: Very difficult to win now yeah i agree
dupeddonk Posted July 1, 2022 #21 Posted July 1, 2022 5 hours ago, kayttobr said: I think the main issue is that at Stake we operate at pre-determined values that are known by the casino which only gives room for manipulation and what not, not saying they're doing it, but there's always a possibility to do so. While stake has the information on the actual results for a certain seed pair, the player has all the control as far as what is predetermined or not. For the outcome to be predetermined, your decisions need to be predetermined. And not just how many bets you plan on making with a seed, also which game you will play and all decisions required by each game. For Stake to be able to exploit predetermined outcomes, they need to know the predetermined decisions you decided to make before you actually make them. In other words, if you're concerned about Stake exploiting you this way, don't predetermine the way you bet /manage your client seed. If you behave in a way that stake can't predict, nothing will be predetermined in a way that can be exploited.
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